very scary people

[rivendellrose]

Scary-ass bastards taken into custody for alleged sedition and other very disturbing planned crimes. Just remember: They're not terrorists. You can tell because they're all white.

In all seriousness (and disregarding the epic fail in not labeling these noxious asshats terrorists and throwing the whole of the disgusting book that we've written up since 9/11 at them), I'm thrilled that the government took this jackasses down. Don't get me wrong - these are not Good People, not in the faintest. But honestly? I'm mostly just depressed. I remember a year and a few months ago, when it seemed like Obama getting elected might actually make me able to be proud of my country again. I miss feeling that optimistic.

Is it just because I'm getting older and I recognize that my country is never really what it claims and wants to be that it feels so bad right now, or is this whole damned nation going to hell in a handbasket - and not in the fun way?

Same story on NPR.

Comments

[cyranocyrano.livejournal.com]

Things have definitely changed. I think it's something that's gone on since I was a high schooler--the Reagan years--and more and more things remind me of the ugly toxic politics of the pre-Civil War years. I find them fascinating to study in retrospect, but I can't find any helpful lessons that I can apply to the current situation.
So much for learning from history.

[stormkpr.livejournal.com]

You said it exactly how I feel. Totally.

[irishninja.livejournal.com]

The country has been like this for a long time. It's just a lot easier to find examples of outrageous acts in the Internet age, when we're all so much more interconnected. Militia groups have been around for at least several decades. For the most part, they are content with tromping around in the woods complaining about the government.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

I don't just mean the militias. I mean people threatening and even outright attacking senators and their families. I mean taking polarization to the point of sheer idiocy.

[akashasheiress.livejournal.com]

It's not just America. There's been a rightward shift in Europe as well over the years, especially showing itself in xenophobia and islamophobia.

[darthparadox.livejournal.com]

About "terrorism"... The threats and vandalism against Congress were terrorism (or precursors to it.) The Tiller shooting was terrorism. The Oklahoma bombing was terrorism. This, though? Their goals weren't coercion and fear; their goals were waging war against the government and inciting other like-minded people to join in. They weren't trying to scare the populace; they were hoping to lead them. "Terrorism" just doesn't seem to be appropriate here.

I'm siding with TNH on this one - I'd prefer to have the more precise terms used.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

See, I think it's up to interpretation entirely because we're using a term that's based on intent. From what I can see, the only possible reason to lay IEDs along the route to a police officer's funeral is to cause the same sort of mass horror that we saw on 9/11.

Or, to use another example, what about the guy who intentionally flew a small plane into an IRS building in Austin, TX a few months back? None of the news outlets I saw called him a terrorist either. And yet, exact same action as on 9/11. Admittedly, he didn't take an airliner with all its passengers, but... to me, this is all a terribly fine line.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I've heard a bit of that. I keep trying to figure out where the zeitgeist went wrong.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

It's just all so damned upsetting.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

So much for learning from history.

Exactly.

[phillipalden.livejournal.com]

See my post:
http://phillipalden.livejournal.com/850079.html

And the link to Brad Hick's post within my post.

It's time to start taking this shit seriously.

[darthparadox.livejournal.com]

I think the IRS plane-bomb thing was entirely terrorism - no argument there from me.

However, it seemed to me that attacking the officer's funeral was less a tactic to cause fear and more a tactic to kill as many officers as easily as possible. But you're right that we're just talking about intent in the first place, which is why it's so much better to use clearly defined terms.

[tnh.livejournal.com]

"more and more things remind me of the ugly toxic politics of the pre-Civil War years."

Finally, someone who's reminded of the same historical precedents I am.

I expect you've noticed that the rank and file are getting fed seriously inaccurate information by their trusted leaders. I used to think their ability to do that was a function of the South's then-rudimentary mass communications systems. Clearly, I was wrong about that.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

I used to think their ability to do that was a function of the South's then-rudimentary mass communications systems.

I've wondered about that, too. It seems that the so-called information age just means that everyone can more efficiently feed themselves only the information they want. If someone wants only yo see hyper-conservative (or ultra-liberal) news, it's easy to get that and only that.

[cyranocyrano.livejournal.com]

It's not so much, even, that they're getting fed inaccurate information. They only go to restaurants that offer all you can eat inaccurate buffets.
(I confess, I cheated. I was a History major with a fascination for that time period. Mostly, alas, because then I could point and say "Hey, it could be worse!" Sarah Vowell is coming to town next week and I'm ecstatic.)