"the long night" and "into the fire"
Jul. 29th, 2010 02:30 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
rivendellroseI can't help thinking we're going through this too quickly, but I'm so excited to see it all again that I can't actually stand the thought of slowing down. :P Spoilers for the whole series under the cut.
The Long Night
Inconsistency: We find out here that Susan's mother killed herself when she was young enough to be playing with dolls (the number 10 is sticking in my head, but I might be making that up), whereas earlier in the 2nd season, we heard that she was old enough that she was doing her mother's hair in curlers and so on. Um. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't let a kid that age (10 or whatever - most people don't play with dolls much past the age of about 13, I don't think, though I could be wrong about that...) put curlers in my hair. Hell, I don't trust myself with curlers. But that's another issue altogether.
"Londo killed Aaaaagh!" I love this conversation between Londo and Vir. It has just the right level of serious concern, gallows humor, and an edge of hysteria. ♥ And, as before, I cheered when Vir killed Cartagia. And again when he waved at Morden's disembodied head. Yay, Vir! And then immediately poor Vir, because he feels so damned guilty about the whole thing, and I just love that about him.
The Boy is upset at Morden being gone now, and that made me think - we really do lose two of our best villains in this single episode. Cartagia and Morden were both fun, horrible, compelling characters who were interesting and appalling at the same time, and they had great chemistry with our heroes. Or, well, mostly with Londo. But I always rather liked when Morden interacted with everyone else, too. Oh well. It's the move from the personal to the impersonal, I guess, as we head into the battle with Earth's forces under Clark.
Tangential to everything but my love of the character, I wonder how much manipulation and calling-in of favors was required for Marcus to be the one to shuttle Lorien over to the White Star? He's so matter-of-fact about it, but I can't help thinking he wouldn't want to be anywhere but with her. And then, of course, every time we see them there on the bridge in the middle of battle, I can have horrible flash-forwards! Yay! *Headdesk*
Into the Fire
Lorien talking about the transitory blessings of friendship, love, and so on, and how "You should embrace that remarkable illusion. [...] It may be the greatest gift your race has ever received" reminds me very much of the "gift of death" that only the Man has as the youngest of the children of Iluvatar. Particularly mixed in with the references to how later generations of Lorien's people grew old and died, while the oldest did not. Very "golden age" type mythology, there, but hey - that's why it's mythology.
Londo finally figures out here that, hey, Morden lied to him. I'm glad to know that did finally come out - I'd forgotten, and was sort of worried he wasn't going to twig to it. And then he begs Vir to kill him to protect Centauri Prime. Oh, Londo. You're such a jerk, but you're also such a squishy. ♥ Good thing the Vorlons fighting the Shadows choose that exact moment to call out for reinforcements and the planet-killer ships decide it's more important to go help them right away then to take the time to blow one more planet to dust first.
All of which leads us up to the final confrontation between Delenn and Sheridan and the Vorlons and Shadows. In the spirit of full disclosure, I was not all that impressed by this the first time I saw the series - it felt hokey and cheap, like they couldn't figure out what to do or something, but... honestly, I think the whole thing comes off much better now that I'm older. Or possibly it comes off better with three glasses of red wine. Not sure which was the bigger factor, but, either way, I liked it much better this time. I find it interesting that the Vorlons talk to John (presumably because of his connection to Kosh) and use no speaker on their behalf other than a woman frozen in ice - wouldn't he perhaps be more receptive if they were to use the image of Kosh, or even his father, as Kosh has appeared to him before?
Meanwhile, the Shadows speak to Delenn in the form of first Ivanova ("Growth through pain and struggle, conflict and war. You of all people should understand this," she says here, and isn't that the truth... sort of. As always with the Shadows, it's a part of the truth, but it's also a really interesting point in the direction of where Delenn is coming from here and why, perhaps, the Shadows have chosen her to convince. Although in reality there's some assumption that of course they picked her because Sheridan had already been grabbed by the Vorlons), then Franklin, then Lennier, then Marcus, and then a mirror image of herself. It's interesting that the Vorlons don't change at all to talk to Sheridan, but that the Vorlons, like they always do, speak through the mouths of others. And of course when we do finally get them speaking for themselves, they speak with Morden's voice. Awww. He was their favorite, wasn't he? ♥
From the guide: "Feels like the magic's gone," Sheridan comments.
"No," Delenn tells him. "Not gone. Now we make our own magic. Now we create our own legends. Now we build the future. Now we stop..."
"...being afraid of shadows," Sheridan finishes.
That about covers it. We're done fighting legends... now we have to fight real people. Civil war, in-fighting, and building up from what remains.
The Long Night
Inconsistency: We find out here that Susan's mother killed herself when she was young enough to be playing with dolls (the number 10 is sticking in my head, but I might be making that up), whereas earlier in the 2nd season, we heard that she was old enough that she was doing her mother's hair in curlers and so on. Um. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't let a kid that age (10 or whatever - most people don't play with dolls much past the age of about 13, I don't think, though I could be wrong about that...) put curlers in my hair. Hell, I don't trust myself with curlers. But that's another issue altogether.
"Londo killed Aaaaagh!" I love this conversation between Londo and Vir. It has just the right level of serious concern, gallows humor, and an edge of hysteria. ♥ And, as before, I cheered when Vir killed Cartagia. And again when he waved at Morden's disembodied head. Yay, Vir! And then immediately poor Vir, because he feels so damned guilty about the whole thing, and I just love that about him.
The Boy is upset at Morden being gone now, and that made me think - we really do lose two of our best villains in this single episode. Cartagia and Morden were both fun, horrible, compelling characters who were interesting and appalling at the same time, and they had great chemistry with our heroes. Or, well, mostly with Londo. But I always rather liked when Morden interacted with everyone else, too. Oh well. It's the move from the personal to the impersonal, I guess, as we head into the battle with Earth's forces under Clark.
Tangential to everything but my love of the character, I wonder how much manipulation and calling-in of favors was required for Marcus to be the one to shuttle Lorien over to the White Star? He's so matter-of-fact about it, but I can't help thinking he wouldn't want to be anywhere but with her. And then, of course, every time we see them there on the bridge in the middle of battle, I can have horrible flash-forwards! Yay! *Headdesk*
Into the Fire
Lorien talking about the transitory blessings of friendship, love, and so on, and how "You should embrace that remarkable illusion. [...] It may be the greatest gift your race has ever received" reminds me very much of the "gift of death" that only the Man has as the youngest of the children of Iluvatar. Particularly mixed in with the references to how later generations of Lorien's people grew old and died, while the oldest did not. Very "golden age" type mythology, there, but hey - that's why it's mythology.
Londo finally figures out here that, hey, Morden lied to him. I'm glad to know that did finally come out - I'd forgotten, and was sort of worried he wasn't going to twig to it. And then he begs Vir to kill him to protect Centauri Prime. Oh, Londo. You're such a jerk, but you're also such a squishy. ♥ Good thing the Vorlons fighting the Shadows choose that exact moment to call out for reinforcements and the planet-killer ships decide it's more important to go help them right away then to take the time to blow one more planet to dust first.
All of which leads us up to the final confrontation between Delenn and Sheridan and the Vorlons and Shadows. In the spirit of full disclosure, I was not all that impressed by this the first time I saw the series - it felt hokey and cheap, like they couldn't figure out what to do or something, but... honestly, I think the whole thing comes off much better now that I'm older. Or possibly it comes off better with three glasses of red wine. Not sure which was the bigger factor, but, either way, I liked it much better this time. I find it interesting that the Vorlons talk to John (presumably because of his connection to Kosh) and use no speaker on their behalf other than a woman frozen in ice - wouldn't he perhaps be more receptive if they were to use the image of Kosh, or even his father, as Kosh has appeared to him before?
Meanwhile, the Shadows speak to Delenn in the form of first Ivanova ("Growth through pain and struggle, conflict and war. You of all people should understand this," she says here, and isn't that the truth... sort of. As always with the Shadows, it's a part of the truth, but it's also a really interesting point in the direction of where Delenn is coming from here and why, perhaps, the Shadows have chosen her to convince. Although in reality there's some assumption that of course they picked her because Sheridan had already been grabbed by the Vorlons), then Franklin, then Lennier, then Marcus, and then a mirror image of herself. It's interesting that the Vorlons don't change at all to talk to Sheridan, but that the Vorlons, like they always do, speak through the mouths of others. And of course when we do finally get them speaking for themselves, they speak with Morden's voice. Awww. He was their favorite, wasn't he? ♥
From the guide: "Feels like the magic's gone," Sheridan comments.
"No," Delenn tells him. "Not gone. Now we make our own magic. Now we create our own legends. Now we build the future. Now we stop..."
"...being afraid of shadows," Sheridan finishes.
That about covers it. We're done fighting legends... now we have to fight real people. Civil war, in-fighting, and building up from what remains.
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no subject
Date: 2010-08-01 04:15 pm (UTC)Love the link between Lorien and the Silmarillion you make here, even if Lorien wasn't my favorite character once he came back from Z'ha'dum with Sheridan. He does lend a very epic, mythological backdrop to the fight with the Shadows and the Vorlons, although, like you, I wasn't tremendously satisfied with the resolution. It felt a little too deus ex machina for me. That may have been less the actual mechanism by which they were told to get the hell out of the galaxy, and more that it took, like, a single scene, though.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-03 06:53 am (UTC)Agreed on all you said about Lorien - he lends a wonderful tone, while still being less than satisfying in and of himself. And, yes, I think a big part of the problem with resolution to the Shadows and Vorlons was the speed with which it was handled. Really, all that build-up for a single quick scene where we basically tell them "no, we're not interested," and they give up, cry to Lorien to come with them, and then disappear? Seriously?
Then again, maybe that's the point - these super-powerful, god-like aliens that we've been both relying on and fearing for the last three years turn out to be just like us. They're petty, they're fighting each other pretty much for no reason, and, in the end, they're afraid of the unknown and want someone to hold their hands while they go into it. It's disappointing, but maybe that's part of the "lesson." The universe loses a little of its magic as they leave (again, hello there Lord of the Rings reference...), and at the same time we discover that our figurative parents in the universe are really just people with flaws and fears just like us. Maybe even more childish, and made so by virtue of their overwhelming powers.
On the other hand, as much as I like the idea of that, it feels like it would have been a heck of a lot more satisfying if JMS had been able to stretch it over a full season like he'd probably intended.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-03 12:13 pm (UTC)I agree with you here, and I like that it ends up being a philosophical solution rather than a military one, especially since at this point it would have stretched belief for the Army of Light to defeat both the Vorlons and Shadows. I put about 90% of my problems with anything in season four down to execution, and the fact that JMS was likely scrambling around, trying to squeeze everything in before the end of the season.*
I did find it an interesting counterpoint to some of the unspoken beliefs that a lot of them shared, especially the Minbari in the form of Delenn; namely, that the longer an intelligent race sticks around, the more intelligent, and noble, and enlightened it becomes. And instead we see these two jerks, still fighting, willing to annihilate whole planets just to prove their point. I wish that the memory of that had lingered a bit in the background of the formation of the Alliance. If nothing else, it's something that could have been explored in "Deconstruction of Falling Shadows," perhaps - and now I'll get a little Galactica here, with 'all of this has happened before, and all of this will happen again.'
*(Of course, then when he does miraculously get his fifth season, and he says to himself, "Self, now I have all this extra room to really tell a story, get in there with all the details - what should I do? Oh, I know!" And then it's endless episodes about smug telepaths.)
no subject
Date: 2010-08-04 03:35 am (UTC)(Of course, that does make it more interesting that Kosh did make an effort to pick images that Sheridan would be receptive to - and that in "Hour of the Wolf", it was the Shadows who spoke in the voice of people's fathers; one wonders if the other Vorlons saw Kosh's more personal approach as another sign he was going soft and straying from their path...)