Purely fandom fun

[rivendellrose]

I'm sure at least a few other people have noticed this article by now. It details supposed 'odds' on who's going to die in the next Harry Potter book (*yawn*) and discusses the idea that Rowling wants to release "director's cut" style revisions of the early books after writing the last two.

However. There are definitely some reliability issues in this. Big ones.

But perhaps it could be Harry's friends Ron Weasley ( 12 - 1 ) or Hermione Granger (10-1)? Harry and Hermione shared their first kiss in the last novel - an experience that left the young wizard feeling "tingling and paralysed" - so her death would create rather a stir.

So yeah. Clearly this guy's reading a different book than I at least picked up. Or is just an idiot with bad sources.

Comments

[ciara-belle.livejournal.com]

Harry and Hermione kissed? Definitely missed that. The author spelled Dobby wrong too. I'm betting he just skimmed the book and substituted Hermione for Cho, or whatever.

Personally, I think Lucius is not long for this world, but I wouldn't put it past Rowling to bump off Snape and/or Dumbledore. She doesn't seem to like Snape as much as the fandom does.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

She has to kill Dumbledore before the end of the series, as far as I'm concerned - the mentor of the hero always has to go, before the hero can really live up to his potential. I'm betting Dumbledore bites it at the end of book six.

Lucius... I'm not sure about him. I've been expecting that at the end of book six he'll escape, and probably play a big part in the climax of book seven, along with Pettigrew.

Snape - my poor, unloved, pathetic Snape... yeah, he's gonna die. There are two options, as far as I can see, for him. My wish is that he die a hero's death, having chosen the side of good and finally redeeming himself for all those horrible things he did as a young man. I'm betting, though, that Rowling's plan is for him either to be killed by Voldie for something totally pointless, or to turn evil in the end and be killed by... oh, Harry, most likely. Or possibly Hermione or Ron. *Sad*

[ciara-belle.livejournal.com]

I will be so beyond upset if Rowling turns Snape evil again. But yeah, I definitely think he's gonna get it. I agree about Dumbledore though. Being a mentor in a great heroic epic type story doesn't really guarantee long life expectancy during the series. I hope Lucius at least makes it to book 7, because I like him.

I feel like at least one of the Weasleys is going to die too. And maybe a few more Hogwarts students. Didn't JKR say something about the death toll really starting to rise in the last two books?

[kleio-the-muse.livejournal.com]

It's going to be war, after all, so I guess we'll lose a lot of supporting characters, though mostly people we only know by name and not many from Harry's inner circle of friends.

I think Lucius will cruise quite happily all the way through book 7, but Snape and Dumbledore surely look like they're on their way out. Dumbledore's death will most likely be a heroic one, being killed in battle with Voldemort himself while defending the kiddies along with the rest of the world.

However, Snape is still a bit of a mystery, since JKR seems to truly despise him (for what reason, I can't fathom), but I still think she'll let him die honourably, fighting for the Order. I'd much rather see him pulling into the background, perhaps influencing the events in some indirect way but still staying outside the actual battle and coming out of it quite intact, and then, after the good has conquered over evil, teaching the Dark Arts happily for ever after - but that's just me:)

Oh, and absolutely adore the icon, btw;)

[zinjadu.livejournal.com]

Just my two cents here.

First off, Ron can't die, at least not until he saves Harry one last time at the end. I really do get the feeling that Ron will sacrifice himself to save Harry. Maybe that's why Ron's always getting so beat up, to get us used to the idea of him dead? Dunno.

I think Lucius might actually make it out of this alive, if only to show that good doesn't always win. The mini-loss being Lucius alive and free and whatnot. And you know that'd piss Harry off something fierce (not that other things don't, like not knowing enough information, being treated like a child, and puppies. Dear god, how he hates puppies).

Lastly, if she hates Snape so much, why has she turned him into such a sympathetic character? Or is she just fucking with the fandom? Anyway, if he doesn't die a hero's death (only kind of death he better have), I can see him living through it all once again doomed to live on. And I get the feeling that Snape doesn't know why he's alive while other, better people perhaps, in his mind are dead. Basically, he's got a survior's guilt complex thingy the size of Texas. Especially if Dumbledoor kicks the bucket and Snape doesn't. Ouch.

I think I've rambled enough for now.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

That's my mom's theory, too - that she's just riling us all up by indicating that she doesn't like him, and all the while making him more and more sympathetic.

I don't know. In chapters like "Snape's Worst Memory," I do definitely get the sense that's what's going on - I don't know how anyone could read that, let alone write it, without their heart going out to the poor slimy little git. *Hugs him*

If Ron dies, it'll be at the end of the last book. I think it most likely, though, that the Trio will survive battered, bruised, traumatized... but still alive and together.

Just my hopeful little theory.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Snape teaching Defense Against the Dark Arts would be the ultimate sign of his redemption. My theory is that Dumbledore has never allowed him to teach it because he knows full well that Snape would be a nasty bastard to all his students in that class - worse so than he is in Potions. It's too close to home, for him, I think. He wouldn't be able to control his temper and memories.

I'd love to see him recover enough that he could teach it. He'd still be a bastard, of course. He wouldn't be Snape if he weren't a bit of a bastard.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

My suspicion is that Ron may die at the end of the books, but you're probably right that at least a Weasley will eventually bite it. Poor Weasleys. :(

My reaction if she turns Snape evil again will probably pretty much be to scream, throw the book, cry, eat a bunch of chocolate, and then start on a fic-writing binge. Pretty much the same as if she kills Remus, actually.

[bluerose16.livejournal.com]

I don't agree with you when you say that Rowling does not like Snape. On the contrary, she adores him, just not as a person ...

When asked "Who is your favourite character?" at the Edinburgh Book Festival she replied "I love writing Snape --even though he's not always the nicest person, he is really fun to write."

Later, at the same interview, she was asked if we would see more of Snape in the next two books, to which she replied "You always see a lot of Snape, because he is a gift of a character. I hesitate to say that I love him..."

I do not think that she will kill Snape, or at least not soon. I hear a rumor from my brtoerh (who heard it somewhere online, there's absolutely no proof behind this, so don't hold me to it) that in the next two books we would see both Snape's boggart and his Patronus. Now Patronuses are all good and well, but I want to know what his BOGGART is, dammit.

I do think Dumbledore will die. That whole father-figure, older-man figure is a bad place to be in classic fairy tales. See Sirius. XD This makes some people think it will be Remus, but honestly, he and Harry aren't as close as fanon would have you think. Harry continues calling him "Professor", and Remus keeps everyone at a distance in order to protect himself (and them).

And I DO think that Lucius will die, but not till the 7th book. He's far too important not to.

I think she kissed him on the cheek in PoA. Maybe. Perhaps the man who wrote the article was smashed.

My best prediction on who is the next to die: HAGRID. Harry loves Hagrid. Hagrid is the quintessential misunderstood, kindly outcast. He is going to die, and Harry is going to be filled with righteous anger. Now the question remains, who will kill him? My best guess is Lucius, but if *I* were writing the Harry Potter books I'd have him injured in battle by Luc and then taken in by the Aurors to Azkaban, where he recieves inadequate care and thus dies. Doubt it will happen, but ...

[/rant]

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

You're right, of course - I'm unfairly critical of Rowling's views on Snape, mostly because I've read comments wherein she claims not to understand why fans like him. Whether she means to smack at people who portray him extremely OOC or simply to growl at anyone who thinks he's a bit of a hero, I can't tell.

In my own bitter, pessimistic way, I suppose I've assumed that she's not the kind of person who really understands him, and he's a character who brings out a lot of protective feelings in me - I very much empathize with the nasty, pathetic boy who was mocked and abused by his classmates, and love the bitter, nasty man he became simply because... I can understand that. I can understand hating the son of the man who mocked you because frankly, I can easily see situations, years down the road, where I will have to hold my tongue and lash my heart into submission rather than treat students similarly, for reminding me of my highschool experiences.

I love Snape because I see the worst parts of myself in him, and because he's a character who could certainly do with a bit of love. As for his boggart... I expect we've already seen it, honestly. It's either that 'dark haired man' who yelled at the woman while the little boy huddled in the corner, or a jeering crowd, laughing at a skinny teenager and his greying pants.

More likely the latter, sadly.

[bluerose16.livejournal.com]

Well, I think her point in telling youn ger fans in particular that they SHOULDN'T like Snape is because, honestly, if he were a real person, he wouldn't be a person it would be healthy to associate with. She doesn't want these kids getting it into their minds that it's OK to throw things at people when you are angry at them (as in the end of "Snape's Worst Memory" in OotP)

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

True. He's a horrible person, honestly. It's just that he's so very real. I certainly wouldn't want children thinking it's okay to be like him, but I think kids are a lot brighter than people give them credit for, when it comes to determining whether or not a literary character is a worthy role-model.

[bluerose16.livejournal.com]

Yes, kids are brighter than she gives them credit for, I think. But then, she's so obviously a Gryffindor ...

Sorry I only replied to a bit of that, my girlfriend called and talked my ear off and I can't type and listen at the same time. @___@ Will go back and reply to the rest of the comment momentarily.

[bluerose16.livejournal.com]

You see, for me, I sympathize also. It isn't that I have been bullied, but close friends of mine have, and if I had, say, Mark's son in my class I would probably be tempted to flunk him instantly. But I can't know that since I've never been in that situation.

See, the thing is, I probably SHOULD have been bullied. I fit the archetype for the bullied kid very nicely. Only I have this apathy thing where I don't exactly care what people think of me, so I suppose the other kids gave up trying after a while. Kind of odd, really. But I do relate to Snape.

As for his boggart, I had the same theories. That was most likely his father, the dark-haired man. I think that Harry makes that conclusion in OotP. I also thought that it might be the Marauders, or a laughing and pointing crowd. But then, it might be Lucius. It might be Sirius. My highest bets are on either Harry or himself, though. Do you agree? That seems far more ... I dunno. Poetic.

^___^ We are going to learn more about Snape's past though, I think. That little glimpse was just the beginning.

Speaking of which, don't you just ADORE the way Rowling does it? Characterization, I mean. She invented the Animagus, which represents the person in an animal form. That's great characterization. Same goes with the Patronus. Also, BOGGARTS?! That instantly tells the reader so much about the character. Also, Occlumency. She's a genius, I swear. My favourite, though, is the PENSIEVE. The idea that Man # 1 can somehow go into Man # 2's memories ... ::waxes poetic::

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

I wouldn't call what happened to me being bullied, exactly, and certainly there are people who got it a hell of a lot worse than I ever did. I was teased, though, and I certainly wasn't well-liked by any stretch of the imagination until highschool. And even then, it was a long road to being considered relatively likeable. And although I don't consider it an excuse for violent or irrationally mean behavior later on, I do consider it a valid reason. I'm very aware, for instance, that I have a tendency to immediately judge and fear/dislike people who remind me of the kind of person who made fun of me when I was that age. And, god help me, if I end up being a teacher, that's going to be the hardest thing to combat.

I definitely agree that the yelling man was Severus' father - I get the distinct impression he came from a verbally, if not physically, abusive home-life. The jeering, laughing crowd seems most likely to me as a boggart, still.... no, wait, that's a lie. I can also easily see him faced with the image of whatever victim or situation finally made him realize "holy fuck, I've sold myself to the Devil," and run to Dumbledore. And that, I think, would be the most poetic possible choice for him.

I certainly hope we are, although at the same time I worry about it being so different from the images and ideas I've built in my mind that she'll make the history in my head come crashing down. *shrugs*

She has a very interesting way of doing it, yes. I personally prefer characterization through simpler things, like dialogue and action. I guess I'm just a traditionalist, in that way.

[bluerose16.livejournal.com]

I can understand bullying being a valid reason. I don't have that reason though. I'm just mean and nasty because it's sexy because too many people pretend to be happy and pretend to be nice when they aren't.

I approach people who I have never met waiting for them to disappoint me. I don't expect it, but I don't *not* expect it, either. Does that make sense. I suppose I am a bit more biased against certain types ... it's hard to describe. I'm naturally much more critical and aloof to very (conventionally) attractive people. Isn't that odd? But it's true. And males, but that's something else entirely ...

"I definitely agree that the yelling man was Severus' father - I get the distinct impression he came from a verbally, if not physically, abusive home-life."

Yes, I think it's almost definite that Snape came from a very rocky home life. Because honestly I've seen evidence in real life that it is the abused kids who are most often ostracized from their peers. There was one particular girl at my middle school, I remember. She was molested as a child, and her parents were very poor and always fighting ... the whole big deal. Yet all of the other kids loathed her, couldn't stand her. It almost seems like an animalistic thing to do, to reject the sick and wounded. The same happened to a boy I knew in 3rd grade who had cancer (he died around two years later).

Yes, but in that boggart situation it WOULD be what he was that Snape was afraid of. The point I'm getting at is that his greatest fear is that he will fall back into old habits, and let himself be manipulated again. But you're right, it's most likely going to be the crowd.

Well, it certainly makes characterization easier. And it provides for situations in which Person A can find out that Person B has been lying to them, because they can see directly from the source the truth. I'm thinking specifically of a fanfic called Civil War in which Harry goes into Snape's pensieve and realizes that Snape's been lying to him about a good many VERY important things for a very long time.

;____; That fanfic was sad. But anyways ...

Did you ever see any of that when you were growing up - that it was the ones who couldn't defend themselves because of their family life that faced the hardest time at school?

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

I did see it, to the extent that a rather unaware and dreamy kid can. My ability to actually absorb people around me seems to've been a bit iffy when I was young. You're right - kids seem to have a bestial tendency to target the weak, the ones who already have weaknesses that make them vulnerable. The fat kid, the poor kid, the one who's withdrawn and sad. And I think that naturally tends to pick up a lot of the ones with bad home lives.

Yeah, I see what you mean. I'd like to think that would be his worst fear, but he seems to hold a grudge for so long that I do think it'll be the crowd. Poor man.

Or, in the case of 'Snape's Worst Memory,' find suddenly that the person has been actually telling the truth all along. You're right, it's a good way to do that sort of thing.

[bluerose16.livejournal.com]

"You're right, it's a good way to do that sort of thing."

It is indeed, because it bridges that gap of mistrust. Harry would have never really believed his father was a bully, even if Snape hadn't been the only one saying so. But seeing it put the truth concretely and irrevocably into his head.

"You're right - kids seem to have a bestial tendency to target the weak, the ones who already have weaknesses that make them vulnerable."

This reminds me: have you read Lord of the Flies? Because if not you really must, it's an amazing book. Not even really a book, it's more like an experience.

"My ability to actually absorb people around me seems to've been a bit iffy when I was young."

It wasn't just you, I think that most people are children are much less aware of others. Who knows?

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Yup - Lord of the Flies was required reading in my sophomore year English class in highschool. Very good, although disturbing, book. *g*

I suspect you may be right on that. Kids just don't have the ability to think in terms of other people's feelings and inner lives, yet, I don't think. Not to the extent they do in adulthood, anyway - and even that seems to vary quite extensively.