oh, forbes

[rivendellrose]

Forbes completely misses the point of the box office success of the Lord of the Rings trilogy, by saying:

Yes the film was about Frodo's quest to throw the Ring into Mt. Doom. But the coupling of Viggo Mortensen and Liv Tyler convinced a lot of girlfriends to sit through more than nine hours of orcs and wizards and hobbits.

Screw off, asshats. I know a fuck of a lot more women who care passionately about those books than I do men, myself included, and most of us were dragging everyone we knew to see that movie, not the boys. And while I'm happy to admit that I loved Viggo as Aragorn and, yes, do happen to like the story of him and Arwen, Liv Tyler is a useless twit who can't act. Also: Eowyn. So there. :P

Ahem. Sorry, I'm rereading the books right now for the first time since The Thesis (tm), and am consequently going through a major bout of "omg I LOVE THESE BOOKS. ♥♥♥" Asshats who persist in thinking that they're either only for boys or that girls are only in it for Orlando Bloom and Viggo Mortensen make me want to scream.

Comments

[gaslightgallows]

There is a persistent misconception in popular culture that people with vaginas are genetically incapable of appreciating anything relating to science fiction or fantasy (including video games) if there is too much violence & gore and/or not enough romance.

This is linked to the equally moronic notion that men are unable to watch any film or TV show that:
• has a woman as a main character
• has more than one woman as main characters
• has women kicking ass and taking names irrespective of men in the cast, or
• all of the above.

This theory tends to disregard box-office hits like Terminator, Alien, Kill Bill, and even The First Wives Club.

(Also: Firefox spell-check does not recognize the word 'vaginas.')

[narsilion.livejournal.com]

(Also: Firefox spell-check does not recognize the word 'vaginas.')
Really? that's unbelievable. Does it recognise "Penis"?

[gaslightgallows]

It recognizes 'penis,' 'penises,' and 'vagina.' It's just the plural 'vaginas' that it refuses to acknowledge. I can't think why, unless it's really that uncommon to refer to more than one of the female genitalia at a time. (But hey, let's talk about multiple penii! ← not a word, thank god.)

Interestingly, and in my experience, at least, people of both genders are actually more comfortable saying and typing the word 'penis' than they are 'vagina.' I've actually had female friends tell me they avoid the word because it sounds too much like a disease.

[narsilion.livejournal.com]

"I've actually had female friends tell me they avoid the word because it sounds too much like a disease."
Wow I find that sad.

[cyranocyrano.livejournal.com]

Hrm. What about 'vaginae'?

[gaslightgallows]

Hmm, 'vaginae' does appear to be the accepted plural. Doesn't help that no one I know (including members of the medical profession) has ever used that word.

Wow, I had no idea Firefox was so obscure.

[narsilion.livejournal.com]

Interesting...I had no idea.

Also...

[gaslightgallows]

I'd just like to point out that I thought the Aragorn/Arwen thing was the absolute lamest part of the books, and while I appreciated that Fran Walsh and Philippa Boyens made Arwen more regal, more equal to Aragorn, and less of a passive player (she's hardly even in the books as a character), Eowyn is still a better character because in both books and movies she actually does stuff.

Re: Also...

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Eowyn is still a better character because in both books and movies she actually does stuff.

Totally agreed. I didn't mind Aragorn and Arwen in the books, and I even sort of liked it in the movies (despite totally not liking Liv Tyler as Arwen) because of how much I love Aragorn, but yes. Eowyn = soooooo much more awesome than Arwen could ever hope to be. :P

Re: Also...

[gaslightgallows]

The most irritating thing? Tolkein originally intended for Eowyn and Aragorn to end up together, but decided that Aragorn was too old and grim for her. I still can't decide which character that's offensive to. :B

Re: Also...

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

...Okay, how had I not run across that before? ...Probably because the one time I read the various "War of the Ring" books with all his notes and crap, I was skimming for info on the elves. *Sighs*

That's sort of charming, really, IMHO - his reasoning for it, I mean. A little insulting to Eowyn and Aragorn both, and definitely not the sweetest thing for poor Arwen (you wait for a guy for how many years, and then he picks some girl up that he meets on the road?), but I'm somewhat delight to think the good professor would have chosen against it for Eowyn's sake rather than, as I'd always taken the Arwen thing to be, that they were Destined because of her whole "evenstar of her people" and him being the last of the line of Numenor and all of that. I think I just like the idea of him caring slightly more for his characters than for his plot, if it's true.

Re: Also...

[gaslightgallows]

That bit of trivia is from The Treason of Isengard. My SO has the whole War of the Rings set, I'll have to go and investigate this further.

As a writer, I can totally empathize with Tolkien's reasonings and having to do right by his characters, and in that sense, the way things happen in the book work perfectly. And since I adore Faramir, I'm more than happy to have him get the more awesome girl--and for Eowyn to end up with someone who doesn't have quite so much baggage. As a gibbering fangirl, I simply would have liked the woman who ended up with Aragorn to have had more of a personality, which Eowyn has in spades.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Yup, that thought is way too common, as are the others that you listed. It drives me crazy. I do have to admit, I don't like a lot of violence or gore either in movies or in video games, but I love nothing better than sci-fi or fantasy movies, and I love the kinds of battle scenes we had in LotR.

[narsilion.livejournal.com]

Wow....just...wow. I really believe that more woman are drawn to the books than men, and waaaay before the movies were even thought of. I know I was. I read the Hobbit in GRADE school,or maybe my first year of middle school, and loved it! I'm 50, and no non-animated films were anywhere in the making!

[cyranocyrano.livejournal.com]

Now I, on the other hand, was there for Orlando Bloom (despite the blonde) and Sean Bean, and the coupling of Elijah Wood and Sean Astin.

[dreamstrifer.livejournal.com]

What a load of crap. Among my high school friends (I was a sophomore when Fellowship was released), it was pretty equal the number of boys and girls that went to see the films and read the books, even! And while I did have one female friend bitch about Eowyn "trying to take Aragorn away from Arwen" (Um... yeah. That's not her sole reason for existing, you doof), most of them were like "OMG BATTLE WOOOO!" in addition to "Viggo is so rugged!"

[xandra-86.livejournal.com]

Hi!My name's Alex, I'm a young woman. I'm Italian. I read the book almost 6 years ago(when I was 18) and it is stil my favourite book. I watched the film too. I completly agree with you! I love orcs, hobbits and wizards and all the fantasy stuff. Despite being a girl, I go crazy when I watch battle scenes and fighting and I love swords :) I hate those who think that women could find interesting only love stories. Personally, I find love stories very boring :) I consider Eowyn to be a positive character, beacuse she goes against the stereotype of the passive woman (always waiting for a man to save her), she draws her sword and fights instead.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Hi Alex! :D

I totally agree with you - I love movies with action scenes, orcs, wizards and all of that, and I adore swords. Nothing against love stories - I like those, too, in their place - but I'd much rather see an interesting and intelligent character like Eowyn who fights for what she believes in than a girl who sits around and mopes.

[ciara-belle.livejournal.com]

Um, I was there for the epic storytelling and kickass battle scenes. And seeing Eowyn killing the Witch King - possibly my favorite part of the books.

You know what would really make studios more money? Just make more good, original movies and stop with all of this gender marketing bullshit and horrible, stereotyped romantic comedies. That is not the only thing that women are interested in seeing and I'm kind of insulted that Hollywood seems to assume that I'm willing to waste $8 on Valentine's Day just because I have ovaries.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Um, I was there for the epic storytelling and kickass battle scenes. And seeing Eowyn killing the Witch King - possibly my favorite part of the books.

Exactly. I mean, there's a reason I've culled all my LotR icons but this one - I adore Eowyn. But still, I was there to see the books I'd loved since I was a little kid made into awesome, beautiful, dynamic movies - not for a romance. I don't even like most romance movies, let alone go out of my way to see them. We had a little mini-crisis on Christmas at my folks' this year because my step-mom somehow expected me to back her on watching "Julie and Julia" over "Star Trek." Which, ha, no. Particularly not with my dad's awesome sound system. &Hearts;

[babel.livejournal.com]

When my dad and I watch the movies, I roll my eyes at him for liking the romance stuff so much, and I am way more into the battle scenes and villains. We both enjoy the epic bromances. Take that, Forbes, or something.

[phillipalden.livejournal.com]

What can you expect from Forbes? I heard they wear neckties to keep the foreskin from popping up and covering their faces.

[narsilion.livejournal.com]

HeeHeee, that was cute!

[kusanivy.livejournal.com]

Oh I've got one worse - at least Forbes excuse is that they're probably all mundanes. I saw a poster (and apparently someone who had been posting to the boards for awhile, not a fresh newbie) on theonering.net once arguing that the upcoming cast of The Hobbit "better be hot, otherwise there is no point in watching the movie."

And when people called her on it, claimed "Oh come on - the whole reason women went to see The Trilogy was they cast hot guys"

My mind - it was boggled.

[diea.livejournal.com]

I'm having trouble even coming up with a character who could be 'hot' in The Hobbit. It's about a fifty-year-old hobbit and a bunch of dwarves. That's not meant to be eye candy folks.

[narsilion.livejournal.com]

????WTF????

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

...Oh, I am so disappointed in theonering.net. I know they can't help having some asshats floating around, but... but... that's just not right.

Honestly, I've been sort of freaked out by a lot of the names getting bandied for Bilbo exactly because they are the sexy type, and that's just wrong for Bilbo. I have faith in GDT on this count, but.. my vote still goes whole-heartedly to Martin Freeman (http://www.imdb.com/find?s=all&q=martin+freeman) for Bilbo. He's got exactly the right kind of hapless cute, and he's just young enough (and odd-cute) enough to appease the corporate folks, plus I can actually imagine him aging into Ian Holm. Which is a nice bonus.

I tangent, I'm sorry. The casting hoopla for this whole thing will drive me crazy until they finally make final announcements for everyone.

[diea.livejournal.com]

One of the things that irritates me about those movies is how much screen time Arwen gets. I love Arwen as a character. The history of her relationship with Aragorn is my favorite part of the appendices. But she doesn't do that much in the books. With so much to write about, with as much as they skipped in the movies, why would they add things? I would much rather have had Tom Bombadil and The Scouring of the Shire than extra Arwen scenes.

As for Forbes thinking men like LotR better than women, I know and care far more about the books and the movies than my husband ever will.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

With you on that. I love Arwen and her story, same as you, but... um, honestly, my problem with her in the movie came down to an intense dislike for Liv Tyler and the way she played the part. I would have much rather had another character.

I know and care far more about the books and the movies than my husband ever will.

Ha, me too. I beat out everyone I know except my best friend at it (she's just plain got large chunks of the books memorized, due to audio books as a child and a scary-spot-on memory for that kind of thing). I've frankly never met a guy fan who can touch either of us on it, though I'm sure they're out there.

[bluerosefairy.livejournal.com]

What a crock of shit. I couldn't care less about Arwen and Aragorn - I went for the hobbits and Gandalf. Also, EOWYN.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

I admit, I do love Aragorn. And Eomer. And, yes, even Legolas (but I loved him before he was played by Orlando Bloom, damn it!). But yes, EOWYN. And orcs, and ents, and elves, and hobbits, and every damned thing. No stupid romance could ever match how much I loved those movies purely for being the books that I've always loved so much. &Hearts;