point of random curiosity

[rivendellrose]

Point of random sci-fi anthropological curiosity for folks to ponder (since my brain is totally out of it today):

How and to what extent do you suppose the rituals of the other castes of Minbari differ from the Religious caste? Are the rituals we see universal across the planetary culture, or do each of the castes have their own variations on marriage rituals and so on?

Comments

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

Variations, with a central starting-point. When the castes were brought into peaceful co-existence a thousand years prior, they probably started with unifying the main rituals as to type, but allowing variation to honor the differences and maintain tradition. Then there would be drift and change and hardening separately over the years. So each caste would have joining rituals and coming-of-age rituals, for example, but they would be different.

My $.02 opinion, and worth exactly that. I like to write Minbari rituals.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Basically the same conclusion I'd come to. It kind of makes me sad we don't get to see Warrior and Worker practices on the show, apart from the brief moments we get of Neroon & co.

I like to, also. Pretty much anything about their culture, honestly - I love theorizing and trying to come up with stuff that makes sense in the context of what we see in the show.

[nhpw.livejournal.com]

I agree with this, and kind of imagine it to not be all that different from the sprouting of different religious practices within Christianity. A central starting point, a bunch of laws and rituals laid down a long, long time ago by a guy everyone involved agrees is pretty awesome, and a book (or prophecy, or whatever) that is pretty well agreed upon across the board... but, you know. Time passes, people begin to interpret things differently, break off into different sects.

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

I think it's appealing because we don't have enough rituals anymore. Everything is so homogenized these days, I find the distinctions in caste structure (and alien cultures in general) fascinating.

Have you ever made up a ritual you wish our culture had?

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Definitely. Especially since it's an idealized form in a lot of ways - there's freedom of movement and marriage between the castes, which from what I've read is rare if not unheard-of in real cultures with caste systems. It's an appealing thought, in a way.

And oh, yes. It's funny - I've always been of the do-it-yourself variety of religious/spiritual experience, and over time that's led me to ditch most of the ritual aspects of how I used to go through life. Lately I've been considering adding at least a few of them back into my daily life. I miss having that.

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

I don't know that freedom of movement and marriage is common, are there examples other than Branmer's switch of castes? I have some vague memory to do with Dukhat, but can't pin it down. I'd always thought it was possible but perhaps not encouraged, but maybe I'm missing some nuance.

All my rituals are more like schedules these days, and very few of them of my own choosing or desire.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

It doesn't seem like it's common, but I get the impression it's accepted? I mean, nobody seemed to think less of Branmer for it, and I know we get mention of inter-caste marriages without any acrimony (and not just in the context of that weird 'exchanging people after a war' sense they mentioned in "Atonement," either). I got the sense both were probably things that didn't happen a lot, that they were difficult and complicated and that there would be a lot of cultural baggage attached, but that it's not like there's a stigma attached. (And yeah, I think the thing with Branmer was that he switched to Warrior after Dukhat died, presumably because they were close. I've always wondered if he was another of Dukhat's students or something, maybe, since he and Delenn seem to have been close as well.)

Yeah. I've got a few little things just for fun. Like, I collect fancy/unusual perfume oils, and when I sit down to work on writing I like to find a scent that fits the character or world or whatever that I'm working with at the time. Mostly, though? Same spot as you. Alas.

[(Anonymous)]

Funny, I always got the impression the religious caste didn't like losing Branmer (or is that some of that pesky fanon sneaking in?) And where are inter-caste marriages mentioned? I only ask cause I have one in an ongoing series and it's meant to be somewhat odd. The whole Branmer thing screams out for more story, doesn't it?

I used to have tea rituals, certain types and cups for certain times and occasions, but it's largely fallen away. I do have lots and lots of holiday rituals and traditions, and seasonal things. Those aren't very regular although that may be why they have lasted; they don't interfere with the demands of real life as much.

[vjs2259.livejournal.com]

And...that was me, forgetting to log back in.

[kungfuwaynewho.livejournal.com]

Good question! I tend to think, like y'all up there, that there are some similarities in the general aspects of the rituals - like, everyone has a watching ritual - but the specifics differ by caste.

But, I kind of feel like Delenn's just really, really religious, even for the religious caste; I wonder how many rituals the average Minbari actually performs. Does everyone really do that two day cooking thing every time they have an important guest? Does every couple actually go through all 50+ rituals on their way to getting hitched? I wonder if there aren't the equivalent of "Easter and Christmas" temple-goers.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Agh, I suck at replying to things lately!

I'm totally with you on the differing by caste bit, and... I must admit, I've wondered the same thing about Delenn. I mean, I find it unlikely that everybody on Minbar would be going through all those 50 rituals just to get married, or at least be going through them with the same devotion that she does. And it seems natural that there would be a lot of people who were sort of ho-hum about Minbari devotions, the same way there are about various Human religions. If nothing else we certainly see that the Warrior caste are sort of "oh, yeah, Valen blah blah, YAWN" about the whole thing, and I can easily see the Worker caste being the same. "Yeah, whatever, Valen, yup, great, pass the fruit, okay, back we go. Cities to build, things you idiots have ruined to fix..."

I'd have loved to see the Warrior caste version of the watching ritual. I bet it's a lot more... active. ;)

[lizbee.livejournal.com]

I agree with everyone else, that there's probably a certain variation of themes across castes, but all are recognisable.

Only, I think that to a certain extent, each caste has unique rituals for their own specific needs. So the worker caste might have a ritual for the beginning and end of a project, and the warrior caste probably have something to deal with PTSD.

[rivendellrose.livejournal.com]

Apparently I suck at replying to comments in my own journal lately, sorry!

Agreed with the above about variations, and a big yes to the rituals suited to need. I do wish we'd seen more of the Warrior and Worker perspectives on things - I bet their rituals are very interesting, and a lot more... purposeful, than the Religious caste's. It would have been interesting.